Lesson 2: Diatonic Modes

[Dave McKay]

Hi Johhny,
I’m sure you’ll clear-up my confusion in one sentence. I’m studying lesson 2, and at approx 4.45 in the video you explain that a Bb is NOT good to play with a F Major7 chord and we should consider one of the modes corresponding to a note in the F Maj7 chord …. the 1st, 3rd, 5th or 7th. But ALL these modes include the Bb ……… I’m Confused.

Hope you can help. Dave.

[john]

yes all the modes include the Bb but we want to play the modes that start on the corresponding notes of the chord. and like I said in the video, Bb is part of the F major scale therefor will be part of all the modes BUT it’s not a note of the F major 7 chord (F A C E)

The reason for this is that as a quick passing note there in no problem playing the Bb over anything, but if we use it as a main note it does create that tension, not being a chordal tone. You need to get used to knowing how to match the right modes with the appropriate chords… this is what it’s all about.

Study the chart in lesson 2 at the bottom under “Chord Tones With Their Corresponding Modes” this is the key and later today I’ll be adding another video lesson there to dig in a bit deeper to help with this concept.

[Anonymous]

That’s awesome Johnny- the fact
that you are so professional
that you are keen on adding
extra videos!

Everyone on this website is so
luck!

I haven’t looked at lesson 2 yet,
will do in a couple if weeks – but
its still interesting to read
questions from other members!

[Dave McKay]

Hi Johnny,
I’m afraid I’m still not getting it. You explained that we use the modes to make the impros more interesting. And that we should use the modes that begin on one of the Fmaj7 chord notes; F, A, C, E? So we can use the Ionian (Bb is note 4), or the Phrygian (Bb is note 2), or the Mixilodian (Bb is note 7), or the Locrian (Bb is note 5)

I’m just not understanding why the Bb is not a good note.

Dave.

[john]

Good valid questions Dave…Not sure about more interesting at this point, but it will make your soling efforts more fitting with the chord progression and that’s the point to get across. Bb is part of the scale of F major. It’s also included in every mode as you say.
The lesson explains that we should use the modes that correspond to the chordal tones: F A C E we would use like you said the Ionian, phrygian, mixolydian, and and locrian (1, 3, 5, 7). We use these modes because they match directly with the notes of the chord we are playing with. Does this mean you should never play a big featured Bb over an F chord? No, in fact it can be really cool if you want to create the effect it gives.
If you play a lydian which starts with the Bb and that Bb gets held for several beats right off the top of the bar you will get a dissonance because the Bb is not a chordal note of F. In my demo of this did you not hear that dissonance? or at least a tension which the chordal notes did not have like the Bb did?
Try it for your self by hanging on to it while playing over the F chord. It wants to resolve because it’s a semi tone away from the 3rd (the A).
If you keep playing it and the chord changes to G minor, that tension in the Bb is gone because Bb is part of the G minor chord.
This is the whole point of these lessons, to learn the best modes that match up to the chords we play over, so the lydian mode is not one of the best matches.
This is all just theory. Every musician breaks these rules every time we play. By learning this you will now know about the kind of tension that note creates on that specific chord and so you can now use that as part of your soloing skills, if you want to create that type of tension in your solo.
But… you are not at that point yet because you are just learning about it all and these lessons are the basics that will form a solid foundation for you moving ahead.

Another thing about modes that you will start to notice as you play them more, they all have their own characteristics which make them work differently over certain chords. For example, the 3rd mode (phrygian) has the Bb as the 2nd note and only a semi tone away from the 1st note A. This is very different than say, the Ionian which has 2 whole tones in a row before a semi tone. As we get more used to all these we can start to take advantage of these differences. Then you won’t be just playing the modes fully up and down like in the exercises. You can play with smaller 2-3 note portions of them….this is one way that you’ll start creating improvisational ideas. But it’s a walk befor you run thing and so learn about the best match-ups for now.
Hope it makes sense!

[Dave McKay]

Hi Johnny,
thanks for persevering with me, I want to get things right in my head because I’m just at lesson 2 and things will only get more confusing if I don’t get it clear.

BUT, I play a Bb over an Fmaj7 (F,A,C,E) and it’s dissonant, how come it’s not dissonant if I say I’m playing it as main note in the Locrian mode (E,G,Bb,D)?

That’s what I don’t understand.

Dave.

[john]

there are other notes that are not part of the F major 7 chord such as the G and D but these just don’t have as harsh (if any) dissonance as the Bb does over the F chord. This is because of the relationship between the Bb note and the A a semi tone below it when the F is the tonic. The desire for the Bb to resolve to the A is just too great for our ears…think of the way a hymn has that common “Amen” ending… that’s resolution from the major 4th down to the 3rd, which is exactly what we’re dealing with here with the mode. Another example is in rock music when the guitars pound out the sus4 chord, like in Pinball Wizard by the Who. To play a sus4 chord means to sustain the 4th because it creates such a dissonance that when it finally resolves to the 3rd a great thing happens; the tension ends and has given our ears the feeling of finally coming home.
if you check out those examples I mentioned regarding the Amen ending and the sus4 in rock you’ll hear what I’m talking about.

[Dave McKay]

Hi Johnny,
yes I understand that the Bb sounds dissonant, I just understand how you say we can use , for instance, the Locrian mode which has a Bb as the 5th note …. and it isn’t dissonant.

After reading the lesson, watching the video 4 times, and reading your explanations – I come to the conclusion that to solo over a Fmaj7 chord I should use the main notes (i.e. the Ionian mode – F,A,C,E), and only use the other notes (G,Bb,D) as passing notes. In that case why were we talking about Modes at all?

I’ve ended up totally confused I’m afraid. Did I see somewhere that you are making another video on this subject? I suggest you explain WHICH notes we can play WHERE in which MODE. I think you are forgetting that we are complete beginners to this improvisation, and maybe making a few assumptions about our (my) understanding.

I hope this input is helpful – I’m sure I can’t be the only person that is not getting this concept ….. early days yet.

Dave.

[Dave McKay]

Sorry Johnny, in the 1st line of my previous post I meant to say “I just DON’T understand how you say we …..”

Dave

[Michael Bishop]

I listened to Pinball Wizard by The Who and you can definately hear that “we’re home” type of feeling Johnny is talking about. It seems like one good chord leads into another, and some chords have related chords that they naturally lead into, but it seems it’s all about “getting home” and we shouldn’t be left with a feeling of “where do I go” now type of feeling.

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